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Discussion Starter #1
I've got a 2016 Navara and I need to fit a towbar for towing trailers and a possible 'van in the future.

Ideally I'd like to fit the 2" receiver available in AUS and the US so that I can switch between a towbar and recovery point depending on what I'm doing.

Fitting in the UK would present no problem. The Navara is classed as N1 and as such doesn't need a type approved towbar for towing.

My questions are:

1) Is towing a 'van with the 2" receiver going to cause any problems with insurance while in the UK?
2) When going to Europe with any possible 'van is it legal to use the 2" receiver setup?

Hoping someone has been thru this as I just can't find any useful information

Thanks in advance
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Oh...well that answers that then.

Do you know if that would expand to Defenders as well? (Just out of curisty, not going to change to a Deafener)

In terms of green lane/off-road recovery, will a ball and pin style hitch be sufficient for this, or should I invest in dedicated recovery points?
 

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Oh...well that answers that then.



Do you know if that would expand to Defenders as well? (Just out of curisty, not going to change to a Deafener)



In terms of green lane/off-road recovery, will a ball and pin style hitch be sufficient for this, or should I invest in dedicated recovery points?


Don't recover using a ball and pin, the ball will sheer off.... I've seen it happen (although not on a Nav). Use a proper recovery point, and a snatch block as well if required.


Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse brevity and mistakes.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Don't recover using a ball and pin, the ball will sheer off.... I've seen it happen (although not on a Nav). Use a proper recovery point, and a snatch block as well if required.


Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse brevity and mistakes.
It was specifcally this one: https://www.tridenttowing.co.uk/trailer-parts-spares-c3/tow-balls-jaw-pin-balls-adjustable-couplings-c242/jaw-pin-ball-couplings-c244/bradley-3500kg-jaw-pin-ball-p10496 where the ball and pin are seperate (fixed ball with lift out pin).

Doesn't the factory recovery point get removed when fitting the tow bar? What have you done?
 

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2" Receiver

Most incidents where balls shear off are when using kinetic (snatch) straps. For some reason in the last decade or so, despite this being the most dangerous form of recovery and requiring the most expensive equipment (the straps aren't cheap and have a finite life), it's become the go-to default recovery technique.

Plain old towing using a tow rope or chain is less dangerous and probably wouldn't snap a tow ball, and this is what the factory tow hook is designed to do.

Last year when VW were trying to plug the Amarok to Aussie journalists, they drove up Cape York (an infamously tricky drive) in Amaroks with only the VW screw-in tow hooks and they were fine for the many recoveries they needed.

To arrive at my point: unless you think it's possible that one day your Nav will be so bogged a snatch is your only recovery option, it is possible to overthink the issue of recovery points.

If you're faced with some situation where you only have a tow ball, you can always wrap your strap (or a load distribution bridle) around the tow ball's cross member, or remove the ball from the tongue and secure the strap through the resulting hole with a shackle.

Neither are as good as a properly-engineered recovery point (using a 50mm hitch receiver or a chassis mount), but both are probably good enough for gentle snatching and definitely good for plain old towing.
 

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I'd definitely take @JDO's advice.

I've seen a ball sheer off once, but it was on a 90/Defender while using a snatch strap, so goes to support JDO's explanation.

He's got a lot more experience of it than I have. My Nav rarely leaves the tarmac.


Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse brevity and mistakes.
 

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I somewhat disagree about the snatch comments.

A snatch recovery uses a Kinetic Energy Recovery Rope KERR. This rope has elastic properties and puts far less strain on vehicle connections. It also stores enough energy to extract a vehicle where a straight pull wouldn't.

I agree that a so called snatch recovery with a strap is highly likely to break something and should be avoided.

A towball should never used for recovery, I have seen many bent and the odd one get airborne.
 

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bear in mind the weight of a nav and then pretty much double it if its well bogged, that will far exceed the towball limit especially if used with a Kinetic Rope, although the shock is minimised the actual stored energy in the rope is immense and I have seen more than a couple of vehicles get seriously broken by folks with all the gear and no idea, you need proper Recovery points as mentioned one either side with a bridal strap or you risk twisty your chassis on a hard pull, am sure you already know but Hi ten bolts are needed as well not monkey metal stuff

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Recovery-Hook-Recovery-Point-Tow-Hook-Rated-10000-lbs-Hook-with-Keeper-4x4-4wd/152517462351?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid=222007&algo=SIM.MBE&ao=2&asc=43781&meid=1ff6497dbebe4d86b2b67a457b381e17&pid=100005&rk=3&rkt=4&sd=192005505814

 

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Bridal strap made me smile, perhaps something that stops the bride from doing a runner before the nuptials?

Agreed with the other thoughts...
 

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2" Receiver

I somewhat disagree about the snatch comments.



A snatch recovery uses a Kinetic Energy Recovery Rope KERR. This rope has elastic properties and puts far less strain on vehicle connections. It also stores enough energy to extract a vehicle where a straight pull wouldn't.



I agree that a so called snatch recovery with a strap is highly likely to break something and should be avoided.



A towball should never used for recovery, I have seen many bent and the odd one get airborne.


Well... yes and no. Kinetic ropes don't magically introduce new forces into the equation, the basic laws of physics and energy conservation still apply. They work by turning the wobbling and inconsistent pull force of a tow rope into a single, long-duration application of force in one direction. Their elastic effect isn't designed to, and doesn't, provide any shock absorbing effect on the fittings at either end of the strap. The work performed (force over time, the mechanical equivalent of kWh) is the same. Actually a bit less as they do not return 100% of their stored elastic energy back into pulling force, they lose a bit to heat and permanent distortion of the strap fibres.

A kinetic strap only puts less strain on vehicle connections than a tow when performing a "snatch"-type rescue. When I say "tow", I mean a recovery where all of the slack in the rope is taken up slowly and gently, not unlike using a winch.

Snatch recoveries have their place when the stuck vehicle is literally stuck but in many of the "help me I'm bogged!" groups I'm in on Facebook, people use snatching where the only problem is the stuck vehicle has no traction. Often by leaving five yards of slack rope and pinning the throttle to the floor. If you used a non-elastic tow rope for that you'd probably separate the body of your truck from the chassis!

It's a great tool and should be a staple in any recovery kit but people have been getting out of bogs for generations without kinetic rope. If you can do a simple tow with a static rope it will place a lot less strain on both vehicles concerned.

Tow hitches (the attachments to the chassis, not the ball itself) are designed to bear very strong pulling and shunting forces and are usually very well secured and braced to the chassis. Securing a strap to one by looping the strap around the steel bar (the one that runs horizontally across the car, to which your tongue and ball are fixed) is fine if you have no other choice. Of course your definition of "no other choice" and mine may vary.

Regardless of what methods you're using, keeping everyone except the two drivers out of the way by at least 1.5x the length of the strap, using quality shackle fittings (or even better these fancy new soft shackles, which I would love to try), good quality well maintained straps, and fitting a cable damper to the strap, will minimise the consequences if something does break. Some competition driving series now require those doing winching or rope work to wear motorcycle helmets and chest armour!
 

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Well... yes and no. Kinetic ropes don't magically introduce new forces into the equation, the basic laws of physics and energy conservation still apply. They work by turning the wobbling and inconsistent pull force of a tow rope into a single, long-duration application of force in one direction. Their elastic effect isn't designed to, and doesn't, provide any shock absorbing effect on the fittings at either end of the strap. The work performed (force over time, the mechanical equivalent of kWh) is the same. Actually a bit less as they do not return 100% of their stored elastic energy back into pulling force, they lose a bit to heat and permanent distortion of the strap fibres.

A kinetic strap only puts less strain on vehicle connections than a tow when performing a "snatch"-type rescue. When I say "tow", I mean a recovery where all of the slack in the rope is taken up slowly and gently, not unlike using a winch.

Snatch recoveries have their place when the stuck vehicle is literally stuck but in many of the "help me I'm bogged!" groups I'm in on Facebook, people use snatching where the only problem is the stuck vehicle has no traction. Often by leaving five yards of slack rope and pinning the throttle to the floor. If you used a non-elastic tow rope for that you'd probably separate the body of your truck from the chassis!

It's a great tool and should be a staple in any recovery kit but people have been getting out of bogs for generations without kinetic rope. If you can do a simple tow with a static rope it will place a lot less strain on both vehicles concerned.

Tow hitches (the attachments to the chassis, not the ball itself) are designed to bear very strong pulling and shunting forces and are usually very well secured and braced to the chassis. Securing a strap to one by looping the strap around the steel bar (the one that runs horizontally across the car, to which your tongue and ball are fixed) is fine if you have no other choice. Of course your definition of "no other choice" and mine may vary.

Regardless of what methods you're using, keeping everyone except the two drivers out of the way by at least 1.5x the length of the strap, using quality shackle fittings (or even better these fancy new soft shackles, which I would love to try), good quality well maintained straps, and fitting a cable damper to the strap, will minimise the consequences if something does break. Some competition driving series now require those doing winching or rope work to wear motorcycle helmets and chest armour!


I forgot to add there is another context where kinetic strap snatch recoveries are useful, and that's where the tow vehicle doesn't have good reliable traction either. In that case the kinetic rope stretches and stores energy while the tow vehicle is moving forwards, and then continues to pull if the tow vehicle briefly loses traction. Useful in, say, sand or clay driving where forward progress is jerky but possible.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks all for your input.

Who'd have thought my seemingly simple question would move into the domain of snatch recoveries :surprise:

So I guess my plan is

Abandon my idea of using the 2" reciever for towing or recovery
Get a standard towbar with the ball and pin attachement linked to earlier for towing
Don't use it for recovery
Get two of the recovery hooks linked to earlier or the Ironman recovery points and fit to vehicle using some suitable bolts

Does the above sound OK?

Thanks in advance
 

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Sounds as though that'd cover all bases! :thumbleft:


Sent from my iPhone. Please excuse brevity and mistakes.
 
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